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Time for a little more honesty!



I tried to share the body of the email here but unfortunately it didn’t work.
I personally see this as an opportunity to get your hands on a decent left bank claret at a pretty reasonable price. If you don’t want it, there are plenty who will snap it up…:wink:


Having viewed this thread with interest I have decided to add my view. I received the email, I wasn’t aware that it didn’t go to everyone. I read it and to be honest was not concerned with the wording of it. The Society chose to sell this wine as it may have been of interest to some members at what I am led to believe is a good price. I don’t know a lot about wine, but even with my limited knowledge, I was able to type the wine name into google and read some information on it, deciding it was not for me.

In my view the Society staff do a great job and I cannot believe that they were trying to do anything else other than give members the chance to buy some wine at a much reduced price. Keep up the good work, I for one appreciate it…


If it’s clarity and honesty you want, I suspect TWS is pretty good in that score. Certainly if you compare to some of the competition* this recent observation shows just how far the less scrupulous will go:


(* no, I don’t really regard Laithwaites as competition to TWS in any real sense, only firms who sell a better quality of product. But at some level they are competing, I suppose)


I got this email. Full text below.

Whilst I agree the on the whole that this email is fine. It does mark what for me is a slow move towards some of the loquacious hyperbole employed by other retailers. I trust and respect TWS for their integrity and honesty; and I distrust almost equally the other retailers who up-sell and hype their wines. I hope that this thread can help stay the hand of content writers and maybe help them to refocus on absolute honesty and integrity in marketing material.

As a side note, if you are editing a piece of text and find use of ellipses then in most cases they are inappropriately used and can be removed. The email below is a prime example.

Having said all this. TWS for the most part do a fantastic job. Keep it up , we are really critiquing an extraordinary organisation. The exceptionally high standard you are held to is quite a compliment.

Perhaps the biggest thrill of being a wine buyer is finding a bottle that delivers excellent quality, bags of character, readiness for drinking and exceptional value… and being able to snap it up for Society members!

Château Malescasse 2002 ticks all of these boxes and has now been aged to perfection (take a look below to find out what happens during time in bottle). Following the success of last year’s offering of the 2004, I have managed to secure a sizeable parcel of this delicious wine from the same property, just in time for Christmas.


I’m fairly immune to marketing but…I would suggest that the email was well written if it made you think of a TWS buyer stumbling around in a producer/negotiant celler in deepest France - thats the beauty of words…we all take them into our mind and make our own story with them.

for me “finding a bottle” could be physically in a cellar / stock room or (more likely) on a list…“securing” = a phone call or email to the seller …words mean different things to different people

as @martin_brown pointed out - he produced the copy but it was from a buyers original draft…the TWS have to make product sound exciting…its their job to sell wine


But if, as noted by @AnaGramWords, the same wine had already been offered by Laithwaites, doesn’t that make phrases like ‘finding a bottle’ , ‘snap it up’, and ‘managed to secure’ sound slightly exaggerated? Some TWS wines ARE discoveries, and this type of copy devalues those. I would prefer any description to concentrate on the wine, not on trying to spin a backstory. ‘Aged to perfection’ is also more Laithwaite-speak.


I agree with you and also an interesting article, but this bugs me…

a machine that churns out Hungarian sauvignon at the rate of 5.8 bottles per second, day and night, 365 days a year

I am assuming this is meant as a random exaggeration, but I think it discredits the article somewhat.

Saying that honesty is important and some marketeers think of themselves as artists and not infrequently chose to apply artistic freedom… they are not and they should not, the closest thing to an artist in this process is the winemaker…


Could well be exaggeration; but it’s quite plausible for a major producer. The Jacob’s Creek bottling line runs at 30,000 bottles / hour, or 8.333 every second. That includes, I think, packaging and loading to pallets - it’s a carton in under a second. The control level is so good they can take in and deliver a new order from vat—>shipping in under 3 hours!

On this level, 5.8 bt/sec is on the slower side!


I am not clear on the reference to Hungary or savvy, but it seems to me that the arithmetic refers to this

the VSPT Wine Group, who in 2016 produced 15.24 million cases, or nearly 183 million bottles , of wine.

If one divides 183 million by the number of seconds in a year, then the VSPT group is indeed filling 5.8 bottles every second.


@AVI6 thanks for the link to CellarFella; an interesting blog.


They are.

I know people who get regular delivery of Laithwaites wines and who I am sure would be better off - both in quality and monetarily - with TWS Wine without Fuss.

But Laithwaites advertise heavily and have bargain basement prices to induce new customers, And they don’t charge £40 membership up front.

So, I’ve been unabe to persuade them to change allegiance to TWS. They say they are happy with the wines they get and think they’re getting bargains.


You are right… not sure where the Hungarian reference came from, that is what I found curious… I am biased, okay… good blog otherwise


I wanted to add that I tasted this wine on Sunday and it most certainly deserves its £16 price probably not more but definitely not less. Very smooth, enjoyable and developed. It’s currently in my basket and worth getting one or two for over the festive period . I don’t think it will last too much longer . An even better reason to order and drink up now :wink:.


Leah, the old adage applies, you pay your money you take your chance.


I can live with most of the description. The bit that I find iffy is “aged to perfection”. I’ve had the 2004 Malescasse (a perfectly decent if unspectacular minor claret), and if that means “it won’t get any better” then I agree. Perfection, though? At £16 I doubt it. But even so it sounds an interesting buy.


I think that is spot on.

They cannot say it is aged just this side of okay though, can they… Or aged, but still drinkable also not triggering too much sales.


That’s more or less exactly how I felt about it. It was good, hanging on in there, but would perhaps have been a little more lively five years ago.

But then that’s why I don’t work in sales.


That’s probably true for most of us here, @Herbster!

“It’s alright if you like that sort of thing”

“It tastes like claret”

etc. etc.


Ready to drink. Drinking well now. Both work well for me without too much hype


Without wanting to stoke the flames too much, I must admit the recent “Treat Yourself” brochure had me wondering too!.

One of my favourite wines is Cairanne. The CDRV Cairanne les Brunei Domaine Delubac 2010 has evidently been slumbering in the WS cellars for a long time too!

“We’ve been ageing this outstanding Cairanne to perfection” etc etc they say. What since 2010? How long, I do wonder