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Paper Bottle

Not really surprised with this, it is a natural progression from bag in a box, screwcap, one fifth of the weight of glass, roughly same price and for everyday wines why not.

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It looks like it pretty much IS bag-in-box, but with a bottle-shaped box.

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I’m deeply impressed. Bag-in-a-cardboard-bottle. And recyclable which is nice - I can see this working for local distribution in conjunction with global import flexitanks.

Over time the glass bottle shape will lose relevance and be replaced with something more sensible (hexagons?) - it’s the future, and TWS as the UK’s largest importer of wine should perhaps be on board?

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The paper bottle seems a brilliant idea. I hate expressions like “6 times lower” though. Does it mean 1/6th of the weight, volume, or whatever?

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I would say 6 times lower than x is: x - 6x = -5x

But then I’m not a marketer, so what do I know?

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Two or three years ago I bought a few bags of wine in Carrefour. They would have been bag-in-a-box but there was no box, just the plastic bag with a working two holed handle on the top and printing all over the bag. The wine was La Cuvée Mythique. Less weight and simpler recycling.

I believe that Tetra-Paks are not permitted in our cardboard recycling because of the plastic film so how does something similar in a bottle shape claim to be recyclable?

Tetra-Pak layers are inseparable. This paper bottle appears to separate fairly easily. The cardboard element is straightforward to recycle, but I wouldn’t know how to recycle the pouch. I expect FrugalPac are able to elaborate further if you would like an answer.

Yeah, it depends where you live. They are OK where in Manchester. And we can chuck any foodstuffs in with the council composting bin. But can only recycle “bottle-shaped” plastics.

Usually I rebel against the plastics rule, by crushing plastic bottles before I put them in the recycling bin. And I have half a mind to melt random plastics, and pour into a bottle-shaped mould to render them recyclable.

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You can get them here too. Usually hold 1.5 li, and are called bagnums.

See my comment above on recycling bottle-shaped plastics :slight_smile:

Seriously, I think the problem with Tetra Paks is that the film is ATTACHED to the cardboard. With those new “bottles” the plastic bag is separate.

I don’t see any substantial new advantage in the Frugal Bottles, apart from the marketing - being able to make the packaging look vaguely like bottles.

Otherwise, why not just use bag-in-box, or indeed bag-without-box. Both those solutions seem to have enviromental advantages compared with Frugal Bottles - either allowing the wine to be pack with less wasted space, or eliminating the need for cardboard completely.

Don’t these rules drive you crazy?
We can put most plastics in the plastic recycling but not polycarbonates or flexible plastic. Plastic film has to go to the big Tesco as the council don’t take it. We have been stopped putting food into the compost bin due to a technical change so now we have to have a separate food bin. I’ve ended up with two bags, two bins and two boxes for the various items and we are also allowed to leave small items like battereis somewhere in their own bag.
I think it has got so complicated that I wonder how many comply or conversely how many just put everything in the rubbish bin for landfill.

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I think the ones I bought were three litre but could have been more.

It now looks like they have gone back to using a box for their rosé.

And there was I thinking my use of bag in box wine was something for the “My secret wine shame” thread.

“Bagnums” - A word I think first coined by a certain Aussie In Burgundy -(the first Ozgundian?) a Mr Andrew Nielson of “Le Grappin” fame. I am delighted to day I was there for his first vintage when getting into his “Winery” in Beaune was, how shall we say -“difficult” as he has forgotten his keys… we tasted in a car park nearby!

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Apparently, in some areas all recycling (presumably not food waste?) goes into the same bin, and it is sorted by the council. It’s the way to go I think. More work sorting, but presumably waste has to checked anyway, and the extra sorting work is offset by there bring fewer bins to collect.

As you say, there must be a lot of household errors in which bins to use. With the best will in the world, I am sure I must get some things wrong.

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Surely they must have been double bagnums?

This is exactly how our recycling is done up here in the Highlands. However it means some stuff can’t go in like glass and batteries. We have to take them down ourselves (supermarket has bottle banks).

Related note: our bottle banks are no longer separated by colour which would seem to be an admission that they are not actually recycled but reused as hard core/in fill material for roads etc.

I do like the idea of that bottle. I don’t want to be opening 5L boxes when I only drink one glass a night. This seems like a better solution for me. Just having them in bags strikes me as a storage nightmare; visions hunting through a wobbly pile liquid bags…

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The separate colour containers for glass seem to be disappearing everywhere, and in fact our local Sainsbury’s has revamped the recycling area and has no receptacles for glass at all now, nor does Morrisons! the problem with glass recycling is or it has been cheaper to make a bottle from scratch than from recycled materials.
So they are all going in the green bin.
And again depending which county/borough you reside in the rules on recycling are different, our last area didn’t even, it was discovered, recycle much at all, most of the green bin was going to landfill with the rest of the stuff.

I think one of the points of wine boxes is that you don’t need to drink it all in one go. Though I did have a friend who just saw the advantage of being able to drink more without the faff of opening mumtiple bottles :slight_smile:

That aside, why not have a 75cl “rectangular” box, which would stack better than a bottle shape? It’s purely an image thing isn’t it? Don’t get me wrong - I recognise the importance of image, but with time it is possible to change attitudes.

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They are indeed used for that (and it counts as recycling), but the main reason for this elsewhere is that there are now cost-effective optical sorters. Whether the glass stream has any value at all at present where you are seems to depend on how well sorted your glass waste streams are, especially the green one. We had a separate discussion on this recently.

Oh yes, and for councils that genuinely do recycle the glass, there are fairly stringent limits on the amount of borosilicate glass (pyrex) that can be accepted in the waste stream, as its high melting point messes up the glass melt.

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