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Man made Whites - Muller-Thurgau, Phoenix, Solaris etc?


For my next U3A tasting I’m thinking of the theme ‘man made wines’, i.e. varieties made by man.

TWS has an ample selection of red varietals, but of whites I can only see Bacchus.

I’m looking for white varietals such as Muller-Thurgau, Phoenix, Solaris etc, one bottle only of each. Suggestions whether they may be found, please.

And if you have a suggestion for the tasting title I would like to hear it as I am stuck at either ‘Sex in the Vineyard’ or ‘Made in the Vineyard’ or ‘Man Made Wines’


Kerner is a good one (Riesling/Sylvaner, I think).

My favourite is maybe Manzoni Bianco (Pinot Blanc/Riesling). The brilliant Foradori make one, and there are a couple more in northern Italy. My favourite, though, is from Catalonia - El Rocallís, from Can Rafols dels Caus.

“Sex in the vineyard” sounds a bit pervy for the times. I think.


“Of splice and men”.


That’s good. Where can I get one?
(cross of Schiava Grosso x Riesling. Very interesting as Black Hamburg - the old table grape variety grown in England and still available in garden centres - is a synonym for Schiava Grosso)

Not come across this, sounds interesting - I like it that the viticulturists name is used. Is it in Sainsburys? :grinning:


@tom ! Magnifico!! That’s the one!



Grapenstein’s monsters?


C hateau Vartely, Moldova, Feteasca Regala, this is a cross from the 1930s, although it isn’t clear if it was man-made or accidental.


Yeah, right :slight_smile:

Foradori are available over here, though (don’t think Can Rafols dels Caus are).


Winesearcher shows only AG Wines whose minimum order is 12 bottles costing a minimum of £250 so that’s a non-starter.


Clever - but offputting. I don’t want to discourage people coming to the tasting by suggesting they’ll be presented with monsters :face_with_raised_eyebrow:


Wow, that’s a TWS one I missed.

But on checking, Wine Grapes doesn’t have it as a variety bred by man, and its number of synonyms and countries it grows in suggests it’s an old variety.


Dunno about WS, but my local shop - Slurp in Banbury - have a few Foradori wines (though I don’t think this one), so there may be others.


not had this but was a fan of Wickham Vineyards…their wines had great ageing potential - had a bottle of their row ash reserve from circa 2008 over the festive period



Grapenstein or grapenfine?

Blue nun vs. Modern muller thurgau

This is why i do b2b trade marketing :joy:


Thanks, @JamesF

English wines are a good source of man made crosses, I named them found in the thread title. Problem is finding a stockist.

I’d especially like a Muller Thurgau or Phoenix as I have both vines in my garden

MT used to be everywhere in my early drinking days, it was the backbone of German wines but it git a poor reputation. Unfairly as far as English wines are concerned because it makes a cracking dry white in our climes


What an interesting topic. @peterm

Doral is a cross between Chasselas and Chardonnay.


Alpine Wines also have a Muller Turgau.


No problem :slight_smile:

Yes, some of the traits from X-ing do make for vines suited to the UK climate

try the Great British vineyards guide website…it might have some info on there


Oh, yes, that’s a step up

Need to get a MT and it might leave some of my audience into thinking they’d get BN :smile:

Hold on a moment!!! I do hope this work is pro bono !


I wouldn’t be buying an English one myself. Even with the British peso being what it is, they’re still poor value in my book.


@suiko I’m open to suggestions of wines that I can get.

BTW that Foradori Manzoni Bianco at AG Wines is £21.99