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Man made Whites - Muller-Thurgau, Phoenix, Solaris etc?


#1

For my next U3A tasting I’m thinking of the theme ‘man made wines’, i.e. varieties made by man.

TWS has an ample selection of red varietals, but of whites I can only see Bacchus.

I’m looking for white varietals such as Muller-Thurgau, Phoenix, Solaris etc, one bottle only of each. Suggestions whether they may be found, please.

And if you have a suggestion for the tasting title I would like to hear it as I am stuck at either ‘Sex in the Vineyard’ or ‘Made in the Vineyard’ or ‘Man Made Wines’


#2

Kerner is a good one (Riesling/Sylvaner, I think).

My favourite is maybe Manzoni Bianco (Pinot Blanc/Riesling). The brilliant Foradori make one, and there are a couple more in northern Italy. My favourite, though, is from Catalonia - El Rocallís, from Can Rafols dels Caus.

“Sex in the vineyard” sounds a bit pervy for the times. I think.


#3

“Of splice and men”.


#4

That’s good. Where can I get one?
(cross of Schiava Grosso x Riesling. Very interesting as Black Hamburg - the old table grape variety grown in England and still available in garden centres - is a synonym for Schiava Grosso)

Not come across this, sounds interesting - I like it that the viticulturists name is used. Is it in Sainsburys? :grinning:


#5

@tom ! Magnifico!! That’s the one!

(Unless…)


#6

Grapenstein’s monsters?


#7

C hateau Vartely, Moldova, Feteasca Regala, this is a cross from the 1930s, although it isn’t clear if it was man-made or accidental.


#8

Yeah, right :slight_smile:

Foradori are available over here, though (don’t think Can Rafols dels Caus are).


#9

Winesearcher shows only AG Wines whose minimum order is 12 bottles costing a minimum of £250 so that’s a non-starter.


#10

Clever - but offputting. I don’t want to discourage people coming to the tasting by suggesting they’ll be presented with monsters :face_with_raised_eyebrow:


#11

Wow, that’s a TWS one I missed.

But on checking, Wine Grapes doesn’t have it as a variety bred by man, and its number of synonyms and countries it grows in suggests it’s an old variety.


#12

Dunno about WS, but my local shop - Slurp in Banbury - have a few Foradori wines (though I don’t think this one), so there may be others.


#13

not had this but was a fan of Wickham Vineyards…their wines had great ageing potential - had a bottle of their row ash reserve from circa 2008 over the festive period

https://www.three-choirs-vineyards.co.uk/shop/wine-list/english-white-wines/siegerrebe-2016/


#14

Grapenstein or grapenfine?

Blue nun vs. Modern muller thurgau

This is why i do b2b trade marketing :joy:


#15

Thanks, @JamesF

English wines are a good source of man made crosses, I named them found in the thread title. Problem is finding a stockist.

I’d especially like a Muller Thurgau or Phoenix as I have both vines in my garden

MT used to be everywhere in my early drinking days, it was the backbone of German wines but it git a poor reputation. Unfairly as far as English wines are concerned because it makes a cracking dry white in our climes


#16

What an interesting topic. @peterm

Doral is a cross between Chasselas and Chardonnay.

https://www.alpinewines.co.uk/alpineshop/view/wines/white/doral?stock=1

Alpine Wines also have a Muller Turgau.


#17

No problem :slight_smile:

Yes, some of the traits from X-ing do make for vines suited to the UK climate

try the Great British vineyards guide website…it might have some info on there


#18

Oh, yes, that’s a step up

Need to get a MT and it might leave some of my audience into thinking they’d get BN :smile:

Hold on a moment!!! I do hope this work is pro bono !


#19

I wouldn’t be buying an English one myself. Even with the British peso being what it is, they’re still poor value in my book.


#20

@suiko I’m open to suggestions of wines that I can get.

BTW that Foradori Manzoni Bianco at AG Wines is £21.99