Since it now seems that the contact details of the importer are soon going to have to be declared on every bottle, how about adding Nutritional Information to that same label?
I thought the importer details were already.
What sort of nutritional info do you think should be on a label?
BTW - as I understand it (and I am not sure where the negotiations are) the plan is for wine labels to be standardised and acceptable in countries party to the agreement, so that wineries (or importers) don’t have to have different labels for each country.
So having nutritional info may involve more than just a national decision.
Eddie, for a useful article on the point you raise if you look on the Sulfites thread on the Community board one member (Mrs Page) has helpfully posted a link to an article by Jancis Robinson on this very issue.
I don’t think the importer has to be there - certainly it is often absent. Neither does the “producer”, whatever that means.
The EU-required information is the company that does the botttling, and presumably the bottlers are required to keep records of where they got the wine for each lot. Often of course, the producer and bottler are one and the same, and I presume that if a mobile bottling line is used the producer goes on the label. In France the bottler often appears on the label in coded form so it is less obvious that the wine is not estate-bottled
Thanks for your kind reply.
Now looking at a packet of Jacquet French Toast (Paris 1885) still made in France and imported into Britain, the details are roughly as follows: Energy value. Fat, Saturates, Carbohydrates, Sugars, Fibre, Protein, Salt. Also, there are the ingredients: Wheat flour, sugar, rapeseed oil, salt, wheat gluten, flour treatment agent: ascorbic acid. POSSIBLE PRESENCE OF: milk, eggs, and sesame seeds.
My point is that we should be informed of the nutritional information and in an ideal world the ingredients of wine. Why should wine producers be exempt from being regulated in this manner, particularly the French who, according to Steve Schlacter, use a code to hide the fact that some of their wines are not estate-bottled. Why do we have to put up with this nonsense from these people, it simply makes no sense whatsoever? Perhaps it really is best to drink organic. goodness knows!
How do you define 'ingredients"? Is it what you put in when you make the wine, or the contents of the bottle? For most foods the difference is largely irrelevant, but wines undergo a lot of chemical transformation.
My suggestion would be that consumers, if at all, would need a mixture of both to be meaningful. So it would not be a simple list in order of quantity, as with foods. My concern is that it would be difficult to collate, especially for small producers I’d like to encourage. Bear in mind that winemaking decisions can be made throughout the whole process, on a vintage and batch basis, and currently some snaller producers order labels in bulk for more than one vintage - the ABV is more or les the same across vintages, the vintage is shown on a small separate label on the neck.
For me, it is not a clear cut issue, and probably the best plan is to decide on things (inputs and actual contents) that MUST be declared, and those that need not. Hopefully that would place minimum burden on low-intervention producers
It’s not just the French who use codes.
The bottler, if not the producer, must be given, but a code can and is often used. This is IMO often to hide a bulk shipped wine.
The code is a number, prefixed with a letter identifying (!) the country where the wine is bottled, so F is France, D is Germanys and UK is W (?)
So, on this wine from TWS
we see it is bottled by W-1740, which is Greencroft Bottling www.greencroftbottling.com
This particular wine makes it clear that it is UK bottled, and the code saves space on the label. But many bulk shipped wines use only the code and don’t make it clear the wine is not bottled in the country of origin. Which is strange, when bulk shipping is promoted as being good for the environment - you’d think they’d want to shout about it.
I’ve just looked at a dozen different wine close to had and a few don’t name an importer but most do, wither by an overprint on the label, a sticker, or a UK specific back label which includes importer details.
But going back to nutritional details; some - a few - wines list ingredients used to make the wine, however that isn’t nutritional info. Although I have seen a few that list calorific value.
I just checked 7 bottles pulled at random (but ignoring self-imported ones) from my wine fridge and none have importer information. So obviously it depends a lot on the wines you buy and their importers.
It did also occur to me that across the pond importers seem to carry more weight, so maybe importer information is mandatory in the US?
I am not clear why an importer name is wanted by consumers.
Regulatory authorities presumably already have have this information
BTW, allergen information is already mandatory on wine if the allergen exceeds a certain limit - presumably the same limit as for other food and drink, but I did not check
(Meant to be a reply to @theclaphamomnibusman, who mentioned allergens, but I clicked the wrong button!)
The sulphites warning is necessary on wine at much lower levels than on dried fruit.
Good point. I suppose if an importer has the ambition to build a brand then every bit of publicity helps. In general terms, it does seem somewhat unnecessary.
For areas you don’t know well, an importer you do know can be some guarantee of quality and a reason to experiment. Some people may trust TWS, for example.
I agree. But this is marketing, and many (of the wines I buy but not those Steve buys) have the importer’s name on the bottle. But I can’t see the point of it being made mandatory.
The importer is not usually the retailer, and people trust, I suspect, the retailer’s judgement.
I must admit I have never heard of people making purchasing calls on the name of the importer. I don’t and Steve obviously doesn’t.
AFAIK, one can only buy TWS imported wines from TWS and TWS doesn’t give the information on which wines they import on their website or printed catalogue. But they do give a customer satisfaction guarantee on all the wines they sell
There you have it! TWS gives a customer satisfaction guarantee on all the wines they sell. What could be more reassuring than that?
I’m sure I heard TWS doesn’t import all the wine it sells
Not in the UK but, as I hinted at above, it is “a thing” in the US, and some buyers have imoorter loyalty.
I also know Brits who are sniffy about restaurants who only stock wines from certain importers. Boutinot, for example, supplies many Manchester restaurants and if you buy from restaurant lists you get to recognise the same wines in different restaurants, which some find boring.
Sometimes I buy direct from an importer that only sells their own wines, but I tend to think of them more as a merchant. At least one of them does add an importer label, but one of their bottles did not come to hand in my sample of 7
No, it definitely doesn’t. I’ve certainly bought wine from TWS but imported by somebody else. Can’t think which ones offhand but I don’t even think it’s that unusual.
I think max PERMITTED levels might well be higher for dried fruit
But as far as I can see the EU threshold for the warning label is 10mg per kg or li for all food and drink. That is pretty much the same as in the US, where it is 10ppm. I can’t see any special dispensation for dried fruit using google, but it is hard to prove a negative