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4 wins! Win-win-win-win (TWS-members-producers-our beautiful planet)

Here in the UK, we only recycle around 50% of our wine bottles, Switzerland and Finland lead the world with a 90% success rate. It is estimated that our on-trade (bars, restaurants and pubs) still send 200,000 tonnes of glass to landfill each year and much of that which is recycled is of such poor quality that it cannot be reused for consumer use, and is ground into aggregate with no environmental use whatsoever.


200,000 where saved in the last year. Maybe the on trade should sort itself out.

The loss of employment in the South African wine industry caused by bulk handling /bladder shipping is of great concern, the political effects must not be overlooked, there are articles from 8/9 years ago about this matter. (See David Smith )one can only assume that it is worse now, the same must apply to other countries,

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The - considered old fashioned in this country now - system of charging a small premium on glass and cans is alive and well in Germany and Austria (certainly was last time we were there 3 years or so ago) where returning said items to recycling gives you the money back. I’ve still not fathomed why we just don’t make it law to do so again here. The cost is zero to the consumer if they simply return their empty vessel.


Because we don’t bottle the majority of wines we drink.

Indeed, but beer cans, and tinned food we certainly do . We could also add the premium as an importation tax on imported vessels. It doesn’t have to be much, nor would it be hard to do.

Sorry, I assumed that you meant the bottle would be refilled.

I put all cans, metal, bottles and plastic in the appropriate wheelie bin the contents of which which are collected by the council for recycling every two weeks.

If I and all my neighbours, have to drive them to a recycling centre in order to get a deposit back I am not clear how the use of a car and burning of fuel helps, and how the cost of someone checking the empty containers in order to calculate how much is to be repaid will be covered.

Unfortunately there is a disgusting minority who sling their empty drink cans and bottles indiscriminately but changing the system used by the majority will inconvenience them without guaranteeing the minority will change their habits.

The problem is it isn’t a minority.

Besides, it isn’t about returning them to a centralised recycling centre, you can return them at any shop. Unless you do all your shopping online - and you may do so and continue to do so after current events - the journey is no extra than that which you were taking. I don’t think it’s any coincidence that the countries that recycle the most are the ones who have legislated the most to put them in that position. We have a mish-mash of ideas and suffer the pretence that’s it’s got anything to do with freedom.


Couldn’t agree more with all of the above. well said

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Very puzzled why Lapin_Rouge’s comment has been flagged, doesn’t seem to be one iota of offensive material in it, just a statement of quite interesting and relevant factual content


We are not here to shame any other member, or to divulge information about a member’s educational background or business elsewhere. You can disagree with a member’s post but this does not give one a right to go into the personal domaine.


Ok, noted, very reasonable, thanks, I would say that the original poster was pushing/pitching an agenda that thanks to Lapin’s post we now know he had a strong business connection to, so suppose there is a bit of public interest defence, but broadly not divulging people personal business/education seems sensible on a forum


Absolutely! You can Google to your heart’s content and reach your own, personal, conclusions. But naming and shaming is not part of this forum’s goal. Perhaps we all have skeletons in our closets, if anyone looked deep enough.



I have never said (and do not say now) that I know the best parameters/criteria for an organic/sustainable wine award. Mark Carney himself has just been accused of greenwashing (this morning).

At the outset of the idea, I suggested that it was up to TWS and TWS members to establish and agree criteria. As this would be a result of conversations and further thought and knowledge.
But this was all clearly a bad idea - you have spoken. I am sorry for badly communicating (wasting your time), I really am, and I wish you all luck and I will carry on my personal journey of trying to find

  1. an economical (in time and money) and
  2. good, quick organic/sustainable/delicious wine, that isn’t 2 dimensional
  3. recommended by a wine-cognisant group. (Rather than a selection of individual, subjective recommendations…which is not good for my wallet or liver!).

Just thought TWS (and members) might help, that is all. It was just an idea. Sorry to offend (and to waste peoples’ time).

Thanks for the detailed reply Luke, I wish you well with it and certainly not a waste of time - good intentions are never wasted.


Luke, more posts, other subjects, keep them coming in.

Try something from the Emiliana winery in Chile. They’re pretty environmentally conscious, besides the obvious issue of shipping wine across the ocean.

I was recommended their Salvaje (careful, there are lots of different ones) on these pages and don’t regret buying a 6-box.

Check them out here

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I think it’s “more” than that - They have, I believe, the largest contiguous organic vineyard in the world, or at least were when we went in 2016. The winery building was aspiring to be carbon neutral but I don’t think they’d managed at that time.

We toured Chile in that camper hired from Buenos Aires. (ahem so much for Carbon neutral…)



Just getting to Chile. I see keyco warriors on the rampage.

Just done Chile in our WSET Diploma class. I must buy some of the reds.